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11th Nov, EMAIL to mini-list & UK-LRO. What engines fit what gearboxes ????

13th Nov, EMAIL Neville Breach

Rover V8 fits LT77, LT95, LT85? and R380 200/300Tdi fits LT77 and R380 R and S series fits VW front drive box from Golf MK1. S or T series fits LT77 A series (longitudinal) fits Fiat box (with mods) B series gawd knows

Allegro never had a B series engine, although the MG and Marina did. The big Allegro engine was the Maxi engine 1750 O series. The gearbox fitted to the O series is a cable change thing but I do not know what it was called.

Cheers Nev

13th Nov, EMAIL, Huw Scourfield

Spag, the O series, right up to the twincam 16v version (otherwise known as the m16, or latterly the t16) will fit to the 1750/2litre Princess gearbox. Some of the Princesses had a 2.2l 6 cyl engine, don't know owt about them!

The O series will also fit the Sherpa/sd1 5 speed inline gearbox and is a good if not heavy swap into the MGBGT.

The O series was only ever fitted to the Maestro/Montego in 2l guise, otherwise they were fitted with A series (Volkswagen gearbox), or E series(Volkswagen gearbox), or the S series (Maxi engine?) -(Volkswagen gearbox). 

The box fitted to the 2l Montys was the same Honda derived gearbox (called PG1) as fitted to the 220,820 Rover .

This 2litre 16v engine is what I have in my Metro, with a modified gearbox (ratios and LSD).

K series was brand new development, mated to puny Peugeot 106 gearbox, Latest 1800 MGF's use the PG1 gearbox with a modified sidecasing. This would really be the best option for my Metro but I'm loath to convert now on the grounds of cost and the big engine beats anything else I've raced against for torque! The K series head is also puny and to get the sort of grunt out of it that I need would require loads of revs, the 1800 K is the same stroke as my 2l (89mm). 

Also there was fitted to the Rover 218 diesel a Peugeot engine mated to the PG1 gearbox, I've discovered that this engine is a cast iron version of the1.9 alloy Peugeot 309 engine, I've also discovered that the Rover m16 head will fit to the Peugeot block! So when I come across a knackered 218 diesel rover I'll be nicking the adapter plate and flywheel assembly, I've already got the alloy block.

Yours forever boring,
PS what you up to spag?

 Ok so does this mean that  O series/m16/t16  will fit :-

1800 Princess/Maxi/Landcrab box,   (oops Landcrab (BMC1800) had a B series engine didn't it),  Sherpa/SD1 LT77 box, A series VW box, E series VW box, and maybe the Honda PG1 box?

Yes the m/t 16 will fit the 1700/2l princess box(don't know how that is related to the 1800,landcrab, ( the maxi is definitely different) - I
suspect the 1800 princess is the same as the 1700/2l. It will fit the SD1 type box with the sherpa bellousing(see MG Owners club
website). It won't fit the vw type box at all, but of course  the Pg1 box was designed by honda but made specifically  for the rovers .

Got any haynes type pics / cutaways or explosions for any of these ?????

I'll have a look, but if you want an easy option then the m/t 16 on a princess gearbox should take an afternoon! - but it will be a little heavy
Personally the Peugeot/Citroen MI16 on a princess gearbox would be hard to beat for space and power! - Would require some alloy welding though to get the sump/gearbox flanges lined up.
Whatever you do - don't go out and buy a Honda gearbox - they are made for engines which run backwards!



14th Nov, EMAIL, Jukka Harkola

V8 Specific questions regarding Viku’s beast  

Hi Jukka,

I am unreasonably interested in the tech details of Viku's V8 beasty.

Looking at the pics on your site it seems that the engine to box adapter plates are fairly straightforward, though it is not so clear how the clutch end works.


The great illusion !! This conversion kept Viku busy for a couple of years, first the initial planning, then finding the bits and then the actual work ! I was very surprised when I heard about his choice for gearbox !

So here’s (quite) a few questions - if that's ok :-)

Was an adapter plate made to go between the end of the engine/box and the clutch housing ??

If you look at the photo showing the various components you'll see several adapters. First there are a couple of alloy sheets fitted on the block. This is to enable the box and block to be bolted together. Then there is a piece of alloy welded on the gearbox case to lengthen the box below the front of the engine. This is because the lock is longer.

OK, that's the odd bit with the U shape machined into it to clear the crank ?

I suppose that a part sump could be fitted in place of that, though strength and sealing would be compromised.

Yes on both accounts.

Then there are the two plates on the left of the photo. The upper shows a thin section of alloy that bolts to the rear of the block. The lower part is the end plate from Princess that has been partly machined to get the surface flat. The upper plate fits between the block and the end plate. The part of the block were the starter is fitted was removed and a new fitting for the starter is on the endplate. Princess starter was used.

That makes sense, I see how the bolt holes line up now :-) Why was it done that way as opposed to just making a single plate ?

I suppose that the Princess end plate carries various drillings /
fittings / bosses for drop gear vs. gearbox so this was required anyway.
IIRC it did not have enough material so a spacer plate was required.

Looking at the length of the input shaft to the box, and the end of the clutch housing it would appear that the transfer gears are on the outside end of the clutch ??

Correct. However the clutch setup is conventional. I.e. block, flywheel, clutch plate, pressure plate.

How much of the box/clutch/transfer stuff was from the princess ?

Box and transfer gears are std Princess stuff. Especially transfer gears are HUGE! Flywheel is partly Range rover, partly Princess. Bolted together !!! Clutch plate is from Saab Turbo, pressure plate (diaphragm) from Rover 800 series.

Don't understand the bit about the flywheel, but I guess that the crank end is Range Rover coz it will fit the crank tail, and the rest was chosen to fit to the Princess gears ?

Yes, the Range Rover flywheel was mostly discarded, the only thing that's left is the flange. Princess flywheel was machined at the center to make a snug fit to the Range Rover flange and these to fitted together with M6 bolts (!!!!), Number of bolts around 10 pcs. This has always puzzled me, How on earth can they transmit the torque...

I can't see any gearchange linkage, does it come out mini-style from under the diff ??

Yes, in fact Mini rod change fits directly to Princess box.

Will the box handle the torque for long without exploding :-)

Judging by the size of the gears yes. Those who have dealt with
princess say that the gearbox is the only thing that never needed fixing...

Was the diff machined just to get a specific ratio or to accept better pot joints ?

Simply for taller ratio, ratio is just about as tall as could physically be machined and still fit in the box.

What combination of parts is used for the driveshafts/cv ?

Inner part Princess, outer part Mini. Outer CV´s normal Mini.

Custom driveshafts to fit from Princess pot joints to mini CV ??

Well sort of, std Mini shaft cut and a slot machined into it. Princess shaft cut and machined to fit the slot. Something like A+ oil pump drive. A sleeve was machined to fit outside the shaft and keep the ends in line. The sleeve is welded on the shafts. Otherwise the connection is mechanical. I can send you a drawing to clarify this point.

This is a temporary budget solution since Viku suspected that the weak point is the outer splines at the CV. He did not want to spend money on custom made set if the CV would fail. He made 3 driveshafts which are basically of same length so he has one spare if one fails.

How much heavier is the front of the car and was the suspension altered ?

Total weight 780 kg, front end 500 kg. Normal tweaks, negative camber arms, std front subframe, Metro vented 4-pots with Mintex pads.

Any idea how that compares to a std mini ??

He did not measure the can but since I also have a Clubman we might weigh my car for comparison.

Was much work required to change the engine bay other than changing the engine mounting points ??

Bulkhead and crossmember behind the engine is as original. IIRC he had to hit a small dent somewhere. Left inner wing is cut at some locations to clear the water pump, oil cleaner and crank pulley.

Right inner wing was cut because of the radiator, otherwise it would have been just about as original.

At front the ex manifold just about sits where the grille is so the grill was relieved of material at some locations and thin spacers have been fitted between the bodyshell and the grille.

He squeezed the engine under the bonnet by tilting it backwards about 10 degrees and fitting a Offenhauser manifold. Also the Edelbrock carb has been machined lower by removing the choke. It starts anyway so who needs choke...

From the manifold shown where do the two pipes join and how are they routed around the engine ??

I think they join just behind the diff.

Hope you don't mind the interrogation :-)

No I don't. You can always check from Viku himself. Try He is pretty busy but hopefully he has time to respond. If not just ask me. I know the details somehow, visited his garage a couple of times when the drivetrain was in pieces.

Thanks again for the information so far, it has really cleared up a lot of issues.

Apart from the minis I also have a Landrover that is in line for a V8 conversion so I am currently finding V8 bits for that, but I am very tempted to divert the resources. It looks like Viku has put a great deal of time into researching what parts can be put together and has come up with a very elegant solution. I think that following his pioneering work it would be a relatively straightforward conversion.

Obviously if I do decide to proceed then a detailed step by step web site will be put together with full credits for tech advice and links to your site for the original car.

I have done nothing on Viku´s car (except welded the oil pickup pipe and borrowed my TIG welder). So if you want to credit someone it is him. I believe he has some rough sketches so you might have a word with him for help.


17th Nov, HARDWARE !!

Collected a FREE V8 block & crank from Alasdair Worsley, from UK-LRO, big thanks to Al J .

winerack.jpg (9372 bytes)

 After (serious) cleaning it could be a nice wine rack !!!

22nd Nov, EMAIL to mini-list & UK-LRO, Haynes for Princess/Maxi/Allegro wanted

no luck :-(

23rd Nov, EMAIL, Theo van den Bogaard

Reply from Theo with GIFs of 1500B series engine & box, 1800 info to follow.

24th Nov, EMAIL, Theo van den Bogaard

GIFs for 1800 engine,diff, transfer gears & box.

B series engine pics

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This page last modified 04/02/2008.